No adapter Big Brakes

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my8950
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by my8950 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:19 pm

timxr8 wrote:The diameters of the 2 are slightly different. The Contour SVT is 278mm vs the Focus 275mm. It equates to a little over 1mm difference, which could put the pad over the edge. Unlikely, but possible. I have a set of these calipers and an extra hub, I just don't have a rotor right now. Nor the free time. OH, forgot to mention the piston is 57mm vs the Merkur 60mm.
If you do get it setup I'd be interested in hearing, as many others probably would.
Please post up if you think of it.
Thanks

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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by noslack2mack » Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:16 pm

John V - you're the real deal, man. When I blew out a rear end I called him up. He spent 1hr and a 1/2 helping me to find a used one EVEN THOUGH I had called to price the Supra setup. He said I simply didn't need it for a daily driver. I just don't believe that John is trying to "sell us" on stuff that doesn't make sense. Keep doing what you do, John and thanks for all the great work you do.

I second the Rock Auto thing for your daily driver pads. You can get Motorcraft pads with sensors for like $25-$30 on there, and that is factory equipment. Do the rotors while you're on it and grease the caliper pins appropriately. Done deal.

Often, I think we fail to realize that these cars were intended to be premium models. They were assembled to a very high standard and it's a shame, but WE are the reason that these cars are not traded for a higher value. Start thinking about that car as the rare gem that she is and stop treating her like a dime store bargain-buster. The Blue Book will follow.
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by hEaT » Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:47 pm

noslack2mack wrote:Often, I think we fail to realize that these cars were intended to be premium models. They were assembled to a very high standard and it's a shame, but WE are the reason that these cars are not traded for a higher value.
I agree, but I also believe the factory brakes are one of the weakest points of this car, especially cars with the smaller master and booster.

One of the best upgrades I did on a street car was putting better brakes on.
Joe
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by Ed Lijewski » Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:55 pm

Got data? ^^

YMMV 8)
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by hEaT » Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:59 pm

Ed Lijewski wrote:Got data? ^^

YMMV 8)
No, just my impressions driving my car with fresh pads/rotors/shoes/fluid on the OEM setup, then moving to the PBR setup up front with fresh fluid and new old-style master, then moving to rear discs/larger master and booster/and better pads (Hawk HPS from EBC Greens) all around. Each change increased my confidence and pedal feel on the street over stock. Even if I don't use the brakes on the street to their maximum ability, the pedal feel and confidence of the current setup makes me feel better driving the car. The stock setup stopped fine (except for some reason it would always lock the left front if I stabbed the brakes) but just didn't feel confidence-inspiring. To me, the feel of the brakes is also important on top of how well it stops. I would say brakes are better even if they stop the same, if they have better pedal feel. I can't back that up with data since it's preference. The stock system didn't have much feedback in the pedal and would go from not much to full-lock quickly. The new setup has a nice, linear pedal, more feedback, and stops harder. Same wheels and tires used on all of the above setups btw.

My brake system has been and still is currently well-maintained with fluid flushes annually so it's not the case of a neglected OEM system being upgraded.
Joe
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timxr8
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by timxr8 » Fri Aug 07, 2015 1:27 am

my8950 wrote:If you do get it setup I'd be interested in hearing, as many others probably would.
Please post up if you think of it.
Thanks
This would be a great solution for the early master cylinder since you lose about 9% in piston area. That will firm up the pedal and make it react faster, while increasing the force required. You do risk of requiring a prop valve for the rear so you don't lock up the rear prior to the front. I am also trying to figure out a rotor that fits right on the rear and has taller brake surface for a taller pad. The focus ones are too short in that respect.
Tim Spencer
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by hEaT » Fri Aug 07, 2015 8:39 am

timxr8 wrote:I am also trying to figure out a rotor that fits right on the rear and has taller brake surface for a taller pad. The focus ones are too short in that respect.
Are the TC rotors better?
Joe
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by DPDISXR4Ti » Fri Aug 07, 2015 12:31 pm

timxr8 wrote:The diameters of the 2 are slightly different. The Contour SVT is 278mm vs the Focus 275mm. OH, forgot to mention the piston is 57mm vs the Merkur 60mm.
Thanks for the data-point -I never noticed the difference in rotor sizes. I've run both with the "typical" T-Bird/Mustang caliper brackets. I mentioned both just in the interest of providing options.

Interesting data-point on the 2008+ Focus caliper actually having a smaller piston than stock. But the caliper looked bigger! :beats head I guess since it's designed for a larger rotor, that accounted for the bigger look. In fact, the greater leverage may still make it more effective than stock. And of course availability is much better.
Brad

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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by thesameguy » Fri Aug 07, 2015 12:45 pm

Could be a stability issue too. Seems like lots of cars from back in the day had poorly designed calipers that would spread or provide bad pedal feel. Anecdotally, that's a problem with C5 calipers, which is why I put C6 calipers on my Fiero. The C6 calipers are quite a bit beefier on the bridge, but totally interchangeable with C5 parts. Perhaps Ford added some metal to the Focus caliper to fix a similar issue.

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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by thesameguy » Fri Aug 07, 2015 1:48 pm

Unrelated, has anyone looked at Fiesta parts? They're 4x108 so our legacy lives on! The ST has 278mm rotors, and I think the calipers may be single-piston version of the PBR.

Image

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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by John Brennan » Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:26 pm

I look at 'em every day... and I can tell you, they are wonderful. The ST is several hundred pounds lighter than the XR, but if there's an application, it would probably be a good upgrade.
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by thesameguy » Fri Aug 07, 2015 3:34 pm

Now I guess we wait for people to start wrecking STs. :D

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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by John V » Fri Aug 07, 2015 4:13 pm

John Brennan wrote:I look at 'em every day... and I can tell you, they are wonderful. The ST is several hundred pounds lighter than the XR, but if there's an application, it would probably be a good upgrade.

hat is too shallow.
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by Ed Lijewski » Fri Aug 07, 2015 4:18 pm

What are th Fiesta wheel and tire sizes?

YMMV 8)
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Re: No adapter Big Brakes

Post by John V » Fri Aug 07, 2015 5:20 pm

always best to start with numbers first
Image

see that 44.4 to 44.75mm depth?
That's the rub....That's where the disc is going to be..

You guys can go waste time searching
2wd Cosworth discs would be a nice upgrade at 283 x 24 But then you're most of the way to the alloy hat, flat disc thing I make THE FIRST TIME and for replacements the second time you're then paying MORE than my set up....

Aside from the sameolddroningarguments from the sameoldcomplainier there are good reasons to upgrade IF you like your car and intend to hold on to it.
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