My 3G Swap

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hEaT
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My 3G Swap

Post by hEaT »

I've seen quite a few 3G swaps, but all done converting to a serpentine setup. I have zero interest of complicating what already works great on the car and when my alt went and the spare I had was also trash, I headed to the junkyard.

This thread is an AMAZING source of info; the bible for a 3G swap:

http://fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55169

While much isn't applicable to the XR, the basics are. I had already relocated my alt to the A/C location using the A/C bracket and a turnbuckle after seeing Ray do the same. I wasn't going to reinvent the wheel for this and I would be using the modified A/C bracket that worked with the stock alt:

Image

The ears on the factory alt are spaced 7", which also happens to match one of the styles of 3G alt. Per the thread above, this can be found on:

  • 93-99 narrow-eared non-DOHC Taurus
  • 94-95 V8 Mustang
  • 94-00 V6 Mustang
  • 94-97 V6 T-Bird/Cougar
  • 95-98 Windstar
  • 91-94 V6 Lincoln Continental


All easy to find cars in the yard, especially the Taurus which only took me 30minutes or so to remove. The Mustang I found looked even easier, but the pulley was seized so I didn't get farther than removing the belt.

$25 later and a 90-day return policy if bad, I had an alt. Tested fine at Advance Auto and brought it home to start the swap.

Quick zap with the impact and both pulley bolts come off easily:

Image

The pulley from the stock alt, although keyed will fit the 3G alt (non-keyed shaft) without issue. It will need a spacer to keep from rubbing on the case though. The spacer (a washer will work fine) needs to fit the shaft on the alt (.670") but also not be larger than the inner bearing race on the front case. Easy enough, just something to note so you don't ruin the bearing. I used a .175" spacer which was enough to get the pulley off the case with a clearance I was comfortable with. It also gave me enough bite on the threads. I think anything over .300" and you'll be at the limit for still having enough threads to safely bite onto.

Next step was to figure out how to mount this. Thankfully, the A/C bracket can accommodate the larger pivot ear which is 3" in length. The XR alt is 2.25".

Image

And now to figure out how to space the alt in the bracket to align the pulleys. I took a rough measurement to get close and then can fine tune from here. I had the stock alt spaced .400" back from the front of the bracket. The spacing here will of course vary on what size spacer is used to kick the pulley off the front case.

Image

To mount the turnbuckle I wanted to use the factory style of a threaded top ear and stud or bolt. The Taurus alt uses a through hole which is .400" diameter. Perfect for an M12 bolt. Tapped the hole for an M12x1.75 bolt I had lying around. The XR uses a M10x1.5 stud IIRC.

Image

Last step before mounting in the car is the wiring. Very simple, especially if you cut the plug off the donor car. The wiring diagram from the link above explains it pretty well:

Image

Here is how it looks ready to go in the car:

Image

The spade connector will plug into the stock connector without issue. It would look better with a nice, waterproof quick disconnect, but I didn't have any. Easy enough to change later.

Mounting is the same as the XR alt. Hook up the charging wire and the +12v lead to battery.

Done and in the car:

Image

Image

All that's left is to throw a straight edge on the belts to make sure I'm in alignment, get a nice M12 shouldered bolt so I can remove the extra nut and make spacers the proper length to replace the washers used now.

Car fired up and I noticed right away the charging light on the dash went off without a rev. With the stock alt on stock pulleys it sometimes needed a blip and now with the MS cold idle set around 1,200 rpm and the Essy pulleys, the car needed to see nearly 2k to kick the alt on, even after a thorough cleaning. After running for a minute and a few blips of the throttle, voltage at the battery holds between 14 and 14.3v at idle with Essy pulleys. Impressive to say the least.

Cost of the swap...$25. Same belt, same wiring, same pulleys. For the price paid, I don't ever see the need if you have an easy way to mount this to put a stock alt back in the car.
Last edited by hEaT on Sat Jul 23, 2011 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
cooperl
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by cooperl »

How much wrap does the belt have on the water pump pulley with this configuration? I was discouraged with this in the kit version.
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Ray
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by Ray »

^^ enough to spin the water pump.



Joe, nicely done. Nice thread and would be great for a FAQ thread. I might do this in the off season.
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hEaT
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by hEaT »

cooperl wrote:How much wrap does the belt have on the water pump pulley with this configuration? I was discouraged with this in the kit version.
Enough where I can torque the pulley bolts and only need to hold the pulley for the final pass around to give it that bit extra. No difference than stock.

I've had zero issues with the belt slipping on my version of the relocate and haven't heard any with issues using Mike's.
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by thedrill »

I cant see from the photos correctly but ..have you mounted the alternator tensioner to the car body?
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by pyropete125 »

thedrill wrote:I cant see from the photos correctly but ..have you mounted the alternator tensioner to the car body?
i was wondering that myself... i think the motor may move around too much for that to work for any real length of time.
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Re: My 3G Swap

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pyropete125 wrote:
thedrill wrote:I cant see from the photos correctly but ..have you mounted the alternator tensioner to the car body?
i was wondering that myself... i think the motor may move around too much for that to work for any real length of time.
That was my concern, that the engine moving around would change the tension and eventually break the tensioner adjuster bolt.
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DPDISXR4Ti
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by DPDISXR4Ti »

Keep in mind, you can also do a 3G swap in the stock alternator location above the power steering pump. Most of us have done it in conjunction with a change-over to Micro-V pulleys and auto-tensioner, using brackets from a '87 - '93 Mustang or '87/8 Turbo Coupe. If the goal was to continue using V-belts with manual tensioning, some combination of brackets should work - feel free to add those data-points if you have them.

Lastly, if using a 3G alternator on the passenger side w/ Micro-V pulleys is your goal, the '92 - '94 Ranger bracket is the answer. Do a search - you'll find a whole thread on just that.
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by RatFink »

DPDISXR4Ti wrote:Keep in mind, you can also do a 3G swap in the stock alternator location above the power steering pump. Most of us have done it in conjunction with a change-over to Micro-V pulleys and auto-tensioner, using brackets from a '87 - '93 Mustang or '87/8 Turbo Coupe. If the goal was to continue using V-belts with manual tensioning, some combination of brackets should work - feel free to add those data-points if you have them.

Lastly, if using a 3G alternator on the passenger side w/ Micro-V pulleys is your goal, the '92 - '94 Ranger bracket is the answer. Do a search - you'll find a whole thread on just that.
Wow Brad, does all this just roll off the top of your mind? I can't even remember what month it most of the time :notworthy .
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by svosyco »

It would look alot like this:
Image
hEaT
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by hEaT »

thedrill wrote:I cant see from the photos correctly but ..have you mounted the alternator tensioner to the car body?
Yeah. No issues with belt tension and Chuck's mounts. Would definitely not work with stock mounts. I will be changing the mounting location though to the bracket. After autocross Sunday I noticed a few stress fractures developing in the steel around the bolt.
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by thedrill »

hEaT wrote:
thedrill wrote:I cant see from the photos correctly but ..have you mounted the alternator tensioner to the car body?
Yeah. No issues with belt tension and Chuck's mounts. Would definitely not work with stock mounts. I will be changing the mounting location though to the bracket. After autocross Sunday I noticed a few stress fractures developing in the steel around the bolt.
Thought that would happen to the tensioner bolt, good idea you had, to swap it back to the engine side.
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by DPDISXR4Ti »

RatFink wrote:Wow Brad, does all this just roll off the top of your mind? I can't even remember what month it most of the time :notworthy .
I'm good with otherwise useless details. :mrgreen:
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by hEaT »

DPDISXR4Ti wrote:Keep in mind, you can also do a 3G swap in the stock alternator location above the power steering pump. Most of us have done it in conjunction with a change-over to Micro-V pulleys and auto-tensioner, using brackets from a '87 - '93 Mustang or '87/8 Turbo Coupe. If the goal was to continue using V-belts with manual tensioning, some combination of brackets should work - feel free to add those data-points if you have them.

Lastly, if using a 3G alternator on the passenger side w/ Micro-V pulleys is your goal, the '92 - '94 Ranger bracket is the answer. Do a search - you'll find a whole thread on just that.
Good info, thanks Brad. When I get a chance later I'll update the OP.

Personally, I like the challenge of fabrication. If there's an easy way to do it...hell no. I'll chop up a good A/C bracket and feel accomplished :lol:
thedrill wrote: Thought that would happen to the tensioner bolt, good idea you had, to swap it back to the engine side.
Lesson learned. Grade 8.8 hardware is stronger than the inner fender :shock:
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Re: My 3G Swap

Post by DPDISXR4Ti »

hEaT wrote:Personally, I like the challenge of fabrication. If there's an easy way to do it...hell no.
Sadly, I fully understand this. You may recall that I'm the guy who's building a truck when I could have readily bought one years ago for way less than it will cost to build. Oh, and the one I would have bought would have been much more functional as an actual truck! :beats head
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